It is utter blindness to take this fatwa in isolation and merely invent your own notions of propriety and choice and use those notions to analyze this case.

The purpose of the futwah is obviously not merely a matter of personal religious discipline. And We know pretty well the consequences of this “religious sentiment” in the creation of pukeland and the ongoing battle in Kashmir.

Let all of us hindu, muslim or christian realize, that our religious freedom is guaranteed by an act of national will. The kafir is fighting to protect the religious freedom of the momin. The unity of India is not a simple and trivial matter. Let it not be trivialized by the secularized apologists of the monstrous futwahs.

By all means individual preferences will prevail. There is no way I can enforce one variety of patriotism or another. But if the ulema of the momin has to proclaim his alligence to religion in this manner, let him in the same breath proclaim his stronger alligence to India. Or at the very least declare he has no intentions to remain an Indian citizen.

I also wonder what the little towns in Britain would have said if the local Jews had a similar complain about pigs. I can just imagine.

In 2005, a federal judge declared that reciting the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools was unconstitutional.

A U.S. district judge ruled that the phrase violates children’s right to be “free from a coercive requirement to affirm God.” The issue is expected to return to the U.S. Supreme Court.

An excerpt from http://tinyurl.com/dofdd

“Making a pig’s ear of defending democracy
By Mark Steyn
(Filed: 04/10/2005)
A year and a half ago, I mentioned in this space the Florentine Boar, a famous piece of porcine statuary in Derby that the council had decided not to have repaired on the grounds that it would offend Muslims. Having just seen Looney Tunes: Back in Action, in which Porky Pig mentions en passant that Warner Bros has advised him to lose the stammer, I wondered if for the British release it might be easier just to lose the pig.
Alas, the United Kingdom’s descent into dhimmitude is beyond parody. Dudley Metropolitan Borough Council (Tory-controlled) has now announced that, following a complaint by a Muslim employee, all work pictures and knick-knacks of novelty pigs and “pig-related items” will be banned. Among the verboten items is one employee’s box of tissues, because it features a representation of Winnie the Pooh and Piglet. And, as we know, Muslims regard pigs as “unclean”, even an anthropomorphised cartoon pig wearing a scarf and a bright, colourful singlet.
Cllr Mahbubur Rahman is in favour of the blanket pig crackdown. “It is a good thing, it is a tolerance and acceptance of their beliefs and understanding,” he said. That’s all, folks, as Porky Pig used to stammer at the end of Looney Tunes. Just a little helpful proscription in the interests of tolerance and acceptance.
“

“Had there been a debate on how the Indian Army was really doing in Kashmir, any possible violations would have been rooted out far before Pakistan could take advantage of the situation there. But we kept silent and kept thinking everything was alright. History now tells us we were not.

There will always be a very small group of people who will put their (and their religious) interests above that of the country. They cannot be rooted out and should not be. US foreign policy on the Middle East is virtually dictated by American Jews and as has been demonstrated by now, it hasn’t always gone in the US’s favour in the long term.”

Do enlighten, Sir. What had the Indian Army been doing in Kashmir, which caused the militants/jehadis/terrorists/freedom fighters to unleash murder and mayhem in 1989?

Increasingly I have noticed this tendency amongst my compatriots to blame Israel in particular and the global Jewry in general for all midlle eastern ills. I wouldn’t be surprised if one day soon, the Jews get blamed for the problems in our own backyard.

OT…

I am not sure why you think partition was a bad thing. Being an alternative history guy, I actually think partition, when it happened, was the best thing that happened to India despite the decades old terror and hatred that is spewed from across the western and eastern borders.

Partition got rid of most of the self-selected intolerant non-secularists (there will always be more). Imagine 850 million non-Muslims and 450+ million Muslims (65:35 ratio) packed in one country. Mix in the Congress I politics of appeasement, unequal laws, reservations, and vote bank. A 1945 India would be a dead waste land right now with far more killing than during partition and probably would have been spilt right in the middle at some latter date. It is also possible that there would be have been no al-qaeda or the taliban (without Pakistan). But radicalist Islam from the middle east would have knocked on non-partitioned India with even a bigger thud.

Pakistan, even better – a broken apart Pakistan, is the best thing that happened to current India.

While I do understand Gaurav’s POV, I am in complete agreement with your point. Those who do not want to sing the song should NOT sing it. There is an Issue only when someone starts proclaiming fatwas against it or organizing a movement against Vande Mataram to deride and abuse it. I think we must all protest when it comes to that.

We must understand the great history of the song and the reverance with which it was held at the time of our freedom movement. It would do much to prevent all the fake histories from dominating, as has been presented here by noted worthies.

For everyone’s information, Vande Mataram has a status equal to the national anthem. This link would be very informative.

http://parliamentofindia.nic.in/ls/debates/vol12p1.htm

Thanks and Best Regards.

I think I am inclusive as far as possible, but disparaging national symbols is where I draw the line. To say that singing national song is equivalent to religious worship and hence a violation of tenents of Islam or any religion is hogwash.Some years back some children of Jehovah’s witnesses had refused to sing Jana Gana Mana or salute the National flag because it violates their religiois tenents, they were summarily dismissed. In reality there is only so much latitude one can give.I would react similarly if someone asked Hindus not to sing “Sare Jahan Se Accha… ” (A beautiful poem) because Iqbal supported Pakistan.

When People talk about inclinations of Iqbal or Bankim Chandra, they forget what power these symbols had for our freedom fighters. I consider the attempt to brand Vande Mataram communal a insult to freedom struggle.

However as I said earlier I do not want such people jailed (which will make martyrs of such unworthies) but socially reprimanded (and not mollycoddled because they happen to belong to “minorities”). Peer pressure as a corrective measure is mostly unappreciated.

Regarding Hindu-Muslim polemics, if you mean to imply that Mahatma Gandhi and Sardar Patel were Hindu leaders (also levelled by many “conservative” muslims before partition) then yes it was, otherwise partition was result of inability of certain Muslim intelletual (predominantly from United Provinces and Bengal) to reconcile with an idea of India where the nature of authority will be predominantly Hindu.

Regards

I came to realise that Sardar’s way was more effective long before reading Menon’s book.

But what I write in this post has nothing to do with political secularism, or indeed about fatwas. But rather it is about individual freedoms and organised patriotism.

Its good that you have read the book by VP Menon. The book is a landmark as well as a very important reminder. This Republic we take so much for granted today, with gentlemen or gentle ladies making comments such as : u sound like India not disintegrating is more importatn than individual freedom.

was largely forged by the great efforts of the iron man with his equally great deputy Menon. The Sardar showed his mettle with Junagadh and Hyderabad, and could have done a great job with Kashmir as well but Nehru kept him out and handled it alone. We still live the consequences of that.

As for Vande Mataram, it was a great and inspiring song of the freedom movement, much loved and sung by the Indian nationalists. The entire freedom movement was overwhelmingly Hindu in character with hindu symbols and leaders dominating. So, this charge of communalism, largely cooked up by the muslim league is redundant.

Reading the VP Menons book, I hope you would have come to realize that the Sardar’s way was far more effective and produced results than the waffle of Nehru. I link this audacity of the muslims to proclaim fatwas against Vande Mataram with Nehru’s waffling response to the muslims post – partition.

Regards.

You suggest that if “secular atheists” had the sense to listen to him, India would not have seen partition.But I thought that apart from other factors like the British divide and rule policy,this type of competitive hindu-muslim politics (and polemics) led to partition.

btw Bankim rocks!!

who ever thinks ill of him or Indian tradition is free to migrate to saudi Arabia or pakistan or china or lala land wherever, just get lost and don’t bother us patriotic Indians anymore.